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slategrey
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Curate
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Reged: 06/25/02
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Posts: 494
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Loc: Finland
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I've created an NPC to sell stuff in Arilles Tradehouse.
When I first go in to see her , all is well.
Next I leave the tradehouse and save the game.
I reload the game and go back in to see her, but she's vanished 
Anyone with a clue to why?
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Founder and "Soul" member of the "I love Kai Globes" Fan Club
Kai Globes v2.8, Apprentice Scrolls and Mystic Quills v1.4 . Don't leave Home without them.
Multi Manniquins V1.2; The Manniquin that changes to suit your needs.
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chia
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Patriarch
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Reged: 07/04/03
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Happens every time? Did you try 'ra?'
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-Chia
Killzone Random Nothings PC Gaming Reloaded
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Quote:
I've created an NPC to sell stuff in Arilles Tradehouse.
When I first go in to see her , all is well.
Next I leave the tradehouse and save the game.
I reload the game and go back in to see her, but she's vanished
Anyone with a clue to why?
Hmmm.... Weird.
She might be wandering off and falling to her death in the void. Check her AI settings, and make sure Wander distance is set to zero so she stays where you put her.
Also, are using any scripts that might be disabling the NPC?
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slategrey
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Curate
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Reged: 06/25/02
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Wander ai settings are 0.
To make matters worse. I unloaded everything but my mod and started a new game.
Head to the tradehouse, chat with my trader, leave tradehouse, save game, reload game, go back in......she's still there. OK I do that a few more times just in case it was a fluke. Nope no fluke.
Eventually I track it down to a single mod causing the problem. The guilty party is a Mod called Advanced Herbalism, and the worse part is I have absolutely no idea why 
If I load that mod and mine together, I have insta-vanishing trader. If I load my Mod and the other 49 Mods I run, everything works fine. If I add Advanced Herbalism to the mix, kaboom, insta-vanishing trader.
I'm stumped.
Chia if you mean ra as in reset actor, actually no I haven't. I'll try that. The point is though I need to know WHY it's happening, and currently I don't.
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Founder and "Soul" member of the "I love Kai Globes" Fan Club
Kai Globes v2.8, Apprentice Scrolls and Mystic Quills v1.4 . Don't leave Home without them.
Multi Manniquins V1.2; The Manniquin that changes to suit your needs.
Edited by slategrey (08/07/04 02:46 AM)
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slategrey
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Curate
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Just tried RA. Nothing. All the other actors go back to thier original places, however mine doesn't reappear.
Advanced Herbalism is eating my NPC 
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Founder and "Soul" member of the "I love Kai Globes" Fan Club
Kai Globes v2.8, Apprentice Scrolls and Mystic Quills v1.4 . Don't leave Home without them.
Multi Manniquins V1.2; The Manniquin that changes to suit your needs.
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Quote:
Advanced Herbalism is eating my NPC
Have you tried running any conflict detection utilities: TESPCD or TESTool? One possibility is that the NPC in your mod might have the same Object ID as something in the Advanced Herbalism mod.
TESPCD
TESTool
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Don't know if that's your actual problem, but here's a tip on creating Object IDs in your mods that can reduce the chance of conflicts:
Anytime you create an object in one of your mods, always give it a clearly identifiable ID that is very unlikely to duplicate anything in another mod.
One system I've seen recommended (which I use) is to prefix your Object IDs with something that identifies both you and the specific mod. In my mods, any Object IDs I create always start with 'DT', followed by something that identifies the particular mod that ID is in.
For example: 'DT_NPC_Tianna' is the Object ID for an NPC named Tianna in my 'MyNPCs' mod (a mod that adds some merchants, guild guides, and other NPCs to my game).
Starting with 'DT' means I know exactly where to find parts of my mod on the Object Window lists in the Construction Set. The 'NPC' part reminds me which mod she's in, in case I have several of my mods loaded. And the entire prefix, "DT_NPC_", makes it unlikely to conflict with any other mod.
As an example, there was a thread not long ago by somebody who needed help sorting out a conflict between two mods: both mods had used something generic like 'Death0000' for an Object ID, and the poster needed advice on how to clean up the problems that caused.
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slategrey
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Curate
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Everything I create starts with dresh_ or Kai_ so it's not a naming problem.
The only thing I can think of to try next is to move my npc into the street and see what happens.
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Founder and "Soul" member of the "I love Kai Globes" Fan Club
Kai Globes v2.8, Apprentice Scrolls and Mystic Quills v1.4 . Don't leave Home without them.
Multi Manniquins V1.2; The Manniquin that changes to suit your needs.
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slategrey
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Curate
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Reged: 06/25/02
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Moved my NPC into the street and all is well. 
I move my NPC back into the tradehouse, she gets eaten after I save and reload.
As I have absolutely no idea why this is happening, I have two options.
1. Add the goods for sale to Arrille (and the dialogue) and see what happens.
2. Build a stall in the street for my npc to sell her goods from.
The NPC is not that important, it's the dialogue attached to her that is.
Ahhh well they say half the fun is getting it to work......they say
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Founder and "Soul" member of the "I love Kai Globes" Fan Club
Kai Globes v2.8, Apprentice Scrolls and Mystic Quills v1.4 . Don't leave Home without them.
Multi Manniquins V1.2; The Manniquin that changes to suit your needs.
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Quote:
1. Add the goods for sale to Arrille (and the dialogue) and see what happens.
2. Build a stall in the street for my npc to sell her goods from.
The NPC is not that important, it's the dialogue attached to her that is.
Ahhh well they say half the fun is getting it to work......they say
I strongly recommend not making changes to Arrille; changing NPCs (or other objects and references) that are already in the game is a very bad idea: too many possibilities for conflicts with other mods or dirty saved games.
See this thread for a recent discussion of why this causes problems.
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Moved my NPC into the street and all is well.
I move my NPC back into the tradehouse, she gets eaten after I save and reload.
Have you tried loading your mod and the Advanced Herbalism mod into the Construction Set, at the same time, and checked to see if there's any kind of collision between your NPC and something added or moved by the other mod?
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slategrey
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Curate
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yep tried that. No apparant conflicts. Ah sod it.
I've made 2 dialogue changes to Arrille that are VERY specific. Both are based on wether the PC is Dresharii or not. It works. If I play as dresharii I get the right topics. If I play as anything else, Arrille is his normal sunny self.
As this Mod is aimed at starting a new game, dirty saves won't (hopefully) come into it. VERY interesting thread and I can see how making changes can affect games already in progress.
To play as a Dresharii you'll have to start a new game, unless you enableracemenu. If you do that, you deserve everything you get 
I'm chalking this conflict down to gremlins and moving on, otherwise I'll never complete this Mod.
For your information, heres a list of Mods I'm running with now. So far No conflicts.
GameFile0=ADVANCED GUARDS.esm
GameFile1=Bloodmoon.esm
GameFile2=Book Rotate.esm
GameFile3=GIANTS.esm
GameFile4=Morrowind.esm
GameFile5=Tribunal.esm
GameFile6=Wilderness Mod.esm
GameFile7=World_Of_Faces_Master.esm
GameFile8=Amulets and Rings 2.1 Upgrade A.esp
GameFile9=Andromache V2.esp
GameFile10=AreaEffectArrows.esp
GameFile11=Book Rotate - Bloodmoon v5.2.esp
GameFile12=Book Rotate - Morrowind v1.1.esp
GameFile13=Book Rotate - Tribunal v5.2.esp
GameFile14=Cali's_BB_V.2_Dryad_Dresses.esp
GameFile15=Chainmail Tops+Slips 1.3.esp
GameFile16=Clean Inscription 2.0.esp
GameFile17=Complete Morrowind - Tribunal & Bloodmoon.esp
GameFile18=Complete Morrowind TB & BM - Replacer.esp
GameFile19=Disturb_the_dead.esp
GameFile20=Divine_domina_part_1.esp
GameFile21=Divine_domina_part_2.esp
GameFile22=Divine_domina_part_3_Tribunal.esp
GameFile23=Divine_domina_part_4.esp
GameFile24=Divine_domina_part_5.esp
GameFile25=EG_bathmod_1.5.esp
GameFile26=GIANTS Ultimate Control file.esp
GameFile27=GUARD- REMOVER.esp
GameFile28=GUARDS.esp
GameFile29=Horror Mod.esp
GameFile30=HorrorMod Patch1.esp
GameFile31=IcesRobeReplacerBM.esp
GameFile32=IcesRobeReplacerMW.esp
GameFile33=IcesRobeReplacerTB.esp
GameFile34=Ice_MQBII_SBLingerie.esp
GameFile35=indybank.esp
GameFile36=Loincloth_top_ pkg2.esp
GameFile37=master_index.esp
GameFile38=Merged_Dialogs.esp
GameFile39=Merged_Leveled_Lists.esp
GameFile40=Merged_Objects.esp
GameFile41=MetalQueenBoutiqueV2-Companion.esp
GameFile42=MetalQueenBoutiqueV2-RacialSupport.esp
GameFile43=More trees and foliage v1-1.esp
GameFile44=MQB_Addon_I.esp
GameFile45=MTT Vol II.esp
GameFile46=MYOTapestry.esp
GameFile47=Necklace_Pack.esp
GameFile48=New Bedrolls.esp
GameFile49=New Robes.esp
GameFile50=newarrows.esp
GameFile51=NWkimono_01_final.esp
GameFile52=Primary Needs 2.6.esp
GameFile53=Qarls_Gothic_Attire.esp
GameFile54=Robe_update.esp
GameFile55=The Undead.esp
GameFile56=WeatheredSigns.esp
Thanks for all the troubleshooting ideas people.
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Founder and "Soul" member of the "I love Kai Globes" Fan Club
Kai Globes v2.8, Apprentice Scrolls and Mystic Quills v1.4 . Don't leave Home without them.
Multi Manniquins V1.2; The Manniquin that changes to suit your needs.
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slategrey
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Curate
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I sent my ESP to Mica Stratosphere and he has the same result as me. Hah, I'm not talking out of my backside afterall.
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Founder and "Soul" member of the "I love Kai Globes" Fan Club
Kai Globes v2.8, Apprentice Scrolls and Mystic Quills v1.4 . Don't leave Home without them.
Multi Manniquins V1.2; The Manniquin that changes to suit your needs.
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Grumpy
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Disciple
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I had roughly the same problem with a companion mod I did, only instead of disappearing (after all, she does accompany you out of the cell (Arielle's)), she would reset to her original position and status if any other mods were loaded AFTER the game had been saved with the companion mod loaded.
Problem on mine was not ONE particular mod that affected the cell that the companion was originally placed in (Arielle's in this case), but ANY mod that affected (made changes to) that same cell.
I eventually removed the companion and had the player do a PlaceAtPC to avoid further problems.
Something that Reznod told me a long time ago concerning this kind of "funkiness": "Put the NPC in a location that the player would not normally visit." That was very hazy wasn't it...
I am pretty sure that you do not want to put them in a cell that other mods CAN effect. I am also pretty sure you do not want to put them in a cell that the player has already been to. I am positive that you do not want to start both the NPC and Player in the same cell.
What I wind up doing now, is creating a new cell for the NPC, but that doesn't always work either. You build them a new house, and five minutes after you put the mod out, you've got complaints from people saying that your new building is half inside another building from some other popular mod...
...and on...
...and on...
My idea: Use a start script:
begin putNPCHere
if ( Player->GetDistance Arielle < 500 )
NPC_ID->PositionCell yada, yada, yada
StopScript putNPCHere
endif
end
PlaceAtPC could be used, or PlaceAtME...
Again, just an idea, and this could have as many problems as just sticking them in there, but this method makes no changes to that cell at all in the mod itself, so if these conflicts are because of initial placement in the mod, this should resolve the problem. However, if the problem is because of the save file, it won't.
Not for sure cause I haven't tried it yet, so it's just a suggestion at this point, but I've had no problems with companions that the player has to manually stick in the game (console + PlaceAtPC), and all this amounts to is an automated version of the same thing, so I have high hopes that it would work.
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Grumpy
My mods
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